Ever
wondered what is the role of an artiste manager? How is it different from being
a mere promoter and what it means to manage an artiste’s career?
To find
out, we spoke to Belinda Ang, artiste manager of Joi Chua, a homegrown songbird
from Singapore who has delivered hit songs including 陪我看日出, 有一天我会，依恋，庆幸有你爱我，and 隐形纪念.
Joi was also nominated for the Best Female Vocalist in Taiwan's prestigious
Golden Melody Awards in 2008. Together, they conceptualized, marketed and
released an independent EP "视界观
PERSPECTIVES" in Singapore & China in late 2012, and the album topped
the charts more than 93 times, with 300 Top 3s and countless Top 10s over more
than 500 charts in China alone.
During the
in-depth interview, she shared on how a manager could value add to the entire
process, how she succeeded in maximizing the limited resources she had to create a
successful launch for Joi’s latest album, and her vision for her artiste. Even
though she is unpaid, Belinda still puts in up to 70% of her time in this job, because she has absolute conviction in her artiste and friend, Joi Chua.
“I always
think she can be better. And why I chose to dedicate myself to this role is
because when I told her, 'Hey I think you can be better,' her reply was,
'That’s what everyone says.' So basically many people said the same thing to
her but they would just say it as a passing remark. No one stepped up to say
that they wanted to do something about it. At that split moment, I decided that
I didn’t want to be one of those people, because it wasn’t a passing remark,
because I truly believe in what I see in her, and this was further affirmed
when I saw her perform on stage, for I felt that I was so lucky to be working
with someone like that.”
 |
| Belinda Ang, social media consultant and artiste manager of Joi Chua 蔡淳佳 |
Describe your relationship with
Joi. How do both of you work together?
My
relationship with Joi is quite unique in the music circle today because we are
exclusive. I do not manage any other artistes. It’s more like the relationship
of the manager and artiste back in the ‘80s where it’s one to one. There are
pros and cons, but this allows me to focus on her career. Apart from managing
the label, there is also the career management portion. A lot of managers these
days do not manage careers. They manage gigs, and it’s up to the artistes to
market themselves. They are more like agents and earn commissions in between.
They don’t manage careers because it’s more like a start up, and you never know
when your ROI is going to be. Agents these days make a living connecting
artistes to gigs and are more concerned with monetary returns. They are also more
likely to manage a label and sign artistes under the label.
I have been
managing her for three years. We started out as Internet friends. We knew each
other on Twitter. Later we met up at Warner Music and became fast friends. At
that time, I had a full time employment. After six months, she mentioned
briefly about the potential of working together, so I planned towards my
independence. It all quite a destiny thing, because I was her first Internet
friend in 10 years, as it was not usual of her to make friends online. At that
time, I wasn’t even her fan, and wasn’t familiar with her songs. It was only
after knowing her that I realized that a lot of the songs that I know are sung
by her, because a lot of her songs were in TV dramas.
How were you involved from the
conception to release of her self-funded EP “视界观
PERSPECTIVES”?
I basically
cover the entire discipline of the traditional label, apart from the music
production. We had partners in China, which were newly established, as I wasn’t
originally from the music industry. It was my first time working on a music album. Although I studied film in China previously,
the music industry and the movie industry are totally different. Moreover, China
changes so quickly that a lot of the contacts that were established previously
are not around anymore.
How did you make inroads into
China’s music market?
There was a
lot of work done in establishing contacts in the earlier part of the year
before we successfully knew who are our partners. Fortunately I’m a social
media consultant, so that’s my strength, and social media is my primary form of
networking. Every night, I would spend time deciding who I want to talk to. I
talked to as many people as I could, and I flew to China in May, just to visit
the social media companies in China, because with very limited resources, no
manpower, no label in China, it is quite difficult to do an onground launch. So
our only and fastest avenue was through the Internet. And with so many web
companies in China, or main social networks like RenRen. Sina, Baidu, they operate
very differently from Western social media owners.
I flew
there to say hi and to understand their business operations and how they could
support us and what are the resources available. I also spoke to some managers
in China, and strategized my launch from there. We launched on Sina Weibo
exclusively for 48 hours, and the deal came together with free placements of
banners and picture links on the other sites that they owned including Sina
Music, Weibo Music, Sina News, and it was quite a challenge negotiating for
those placements which otherwise would have earned them revenue. Because of our
exclusive terms and special relationships that we and our partners had with
them, we were able to garner many featured spaces. It was purely a digital
launch during the first phase. They linked to the music sites in China. Sina
owns their own music site, just as Baidu and QQ too. So we need to provide exclusivity to each of these
giants so that they do not discriminate you, because if you only work with one
of them, you may end up discriminated and they may not play your new songs. We have to be fair to everyone and give each owner a different form
of exclusivity, for example, to keep different images for different sites.
How did the launch turn out?
We topped
the 24-hour charts in Sina, we also topped many other radio charts. In China
there are the live charts and the 24-hour charts, and ranking is measured by
the number of listens within that specific time frame. To be honest, anything
can be bought, including listens, so to be able to achieve that kind of results
with zero marketing budget, we were quite surprised and very happy. But we knew
that we could do more if we were under a label. There will always be tradeoffs
for that. Without resources from the label, we are forced to become more
creative, and we were fortunate to be able to find partners who were passionate
enough about your product to work with. Our partners are also not paid. We all came
together with a vision and the same passion. The entire team worked 24/7 just
for a vision.
What was it like working with
your China partners?
We were
working with DP Music, which is a small independent label in China, but they do
work with some big names, promoting concerts for Sandy Lam, and they have been
around in the market for a long time, previously under another label and
eventually they came out and started their own company. They see our vision,
and they are as passionate about Joi as I am, so they committed the entire team
to the project. This meant that the owner had to feed the entire team without
profits in mind. They worked on the project for close to 9 months: we started in May 2012 and only
finished the China promotions only in November. Their specialization is in
A&R and promotions. They helped us cover a lot of on-ground work, including
sending our songs to over 800 radio stations, clearance with publishing because
foreign companies cannot claim publishing rights in China hence a local
publisher is required. We worked with them to clear legal requirements.
Contrary to
the thought by most people that there is a lot of piracy in China, actually all
the major online sites that you see are legal, but there is an entire process
of clearing your copyright, and every platform requires a unique clearance. In
China, there is no one-stop service, because they are not united, so even if
you are from the publishing house, you still need to go to each media owner
individually to clear the rights.
There are
agents who have access to X number of companies, and you need to pay these
agents. If you were to go through agents, you would be able to distribute your
music but we
would prefer going to media owners individually so that we can negotiate for marketing
resources or better placements in the different platforms. We might talk to
their marketing staff and not the distribution staff. But of course, it is a
very tedious and long process, and I was burnt out. It took me six months to
recuperate from then!
What was the biggest challenge that
you faced?
Publishing
rights were the biggest challenge and it was the one thing that took me a
really long time to understand. There was no mentorship or help out there on
understanding publishing rights. Publishing rights differ from one country to
another. They are different in different platforms. Contracts come in all
shapes and sizes. I asked a lot of questions, begging them to explain to me
what the clauses meant. Clearing the rights for CD, digital and via a
thumbdrive had different implications. We had to authorize our publishing
rights to our partners in China, and in turn, they had to authorize the rights
to the local platforms, and the distribution had to be cleared through the
COMPASS equivalent in China.
Joi is a
writer under Warner Chappell (WMC) Taiwan. WMC will clear the publishing rights
for the writers for Joi Music, and Joi Music will authorize the rights to WMC
in Taiwan. WMC handles our distribution in Taiwan. Joi Music is a label that
Joi started which handles production and artiste management. I manage the
business part of Joi Music. The company is set up for
accounting purposes and collect royalties. It also allows us to better
structure our contracts.
What are your thoughts on consumers
buying music?
If you are
not a fan, you will not spend a single cent to buy music. Even if music was
within reach in legitimate digital platforms, you would simply download it for
free. But if you are a fan, even if I charged you $100, you would still buy it.
So we were willing to spend quite a bit in creating a box set for Joi’s EP. It
included a lyric book, a thumbdrive, a set of 7 cards of quotes that were
written by Joi on perspectives of life. We wanted to make it a collectible for
fans, something that adds value to them. We chose the thumbdrive because of a
few reasons. No point using a CD because nobody uses this format anymore and
they would simply rip the tracks off and put them into their phones or mobile
players. The thumbdrive was in a shape of a pair of spectacles, which links
back to the concept of “Perspectives”. inside the thumbdrive we included an
entire suite of content: the mp3s, ringtones, SMS message tones which were
recorded with her own voice, lossless formats for the tracks, exclusive videos
that has not been exposed, desktop wall papers, iPhone wall papers, Facebook
covers, Weibo backdrops and more. So when the fan receives the package, it’s
very big and exciting for them. The great thing about selling the box set to
fans is that they don’t leak the content out. The content was so confidential
prior to the launch that we hired our own line of production because other factories refused to sign an Non-Disclosure Agreement. It’s definitely more
expensive, and I deeply discourage anyone from following so. But I was stubborn
because it was my first album.
We had a
run of 3000 copies, but each copy was sold at a premium price. My point of view: music should not be cheaper, it should become more
and more expensive. The difference lies in adding value. If a Starbucks Frappuccino
can be sold for seven dollars, or an empty notebook can be sold for forty
dollars, I don’t understand why you can’t buy music for more. I think the only
difference is that there needs to be a re-education into the entire system.
Music formats have changed, but the re-education does not come overnight. No
one thought that we would sell a single copy, and although we did not manage to
break even, I think we need to start changing the perspectives of people. It’s
how you add value to your fans. It’s not about how you should price your music.
Music is a product on its own, but people don’t sell products, they sell
brands. Yes, there are instances that good music can go very far, but how often
do we see that? We also see terrible music going very far. Why? It’s because
they have terrible products but good brands. And if the good brand comes with a
very good product, then the sustainability is longer. If I were to sell you an aluminum
can with cola inside for 10 cents, you still wouldn’t even buy it, but if it
had a red label outside that says Coca-cola, I could sell it to you for a
dollar. I come from a branding background, so I deeply believe in creating
brands, and I see Joi as a brand; all her songs are products. So creating an EP
or box set is basically packaging the product, but it needs to bring up my
brand, that’s why I’m spending so much effort in it. Joi feels the same way,
but obviously it’s quite painful for her because there is a lot of money
involved! haha
We sold the
box set for USD28, exclusively online from her website www.joichua.com . In China,
we worked with the e-commerce sites to sell the box sets at RMB149 each. We
kept the quantity very small because we did not expect it to sell like hot
cakes, especially at such a high price. I’m very grateful that there are many
supporters from Singapore, and surprisingly we had orders from Japan, Spain,
Australia. So the great thing about doing your own distribution is that you get
to know where your fans are from. The interesting thing is that the box set was
selling at USD28, but the postage to Japan was USD30, so the total for that box
set was USD60, and they still didn’t think it was expensive.
What is it like managing Joi
without the backing of a major label?
Prior to
our stints in Singapore, no one thought that, without a label, we would not be
able to step out of Singapore. Most people would think, why don’t you sign with
a major label, especially since there are labels coming to her? But she has
certain insistence with the quality and ownership of the music. She wants
better control over her music. So when she were to join another label, that
would be part of what she would negotiation terms. Joi is not a 18 year old
girl, so she is at the part of her career that it is time to make decisions for
herself. Although running her own label would be a lot harder, especially since
we did not attempt to find investors or VCs. We wanted to work with brands but
did not have the time to do so. There are some business decisions that weren’t
the smartest to make, but we did not want to compromise the quality, and that
was the one agreement we knew we had.
We clearly understood that you could not
have one EP and, boom, you make it big. Brands need to be built over time, but
at least we have started somewhere. For me, if I’m going to invest X dollars to
create three songs and launch it for Singapore’s market, the cost is going to
be the same even if I include the China market. So I might as well create the
album for 3, 4 ,5 markets. Similarly, if I’m going to spend three months
marketing the album in market, might as well spend the same time marketing in
several markets. So it doesn’t make sense to be localized, especially when I
know that the local market it small, and the sad truth is, we do give more
respect to musicians who make it out of Singapore. It’s the truth that a lot of
us don’t want to admit, but that’s the truth. However, we do not compromise
with the Singapore market. We work very closely with the local media, and to be
honest, I’m really touched by the local radio stations who have given us a lot
of support although we have nothing to offer.
What were your considerations
when deciding which market to focus on promoting her album?
Because of
time and resource constraints, I was making my bet on either focusing on Taiwan
or China. I could only choose one of the two. The reason why people go to
Taiwan is because if they are popular in Taiwan, they would be able to sell in
China. So to me, it does not make sense to go to Taiwan, because the end
destination is still China. We actually bypassed the entire Taiwan for this
particular launch. A lot of people think it’s quite silly because many of the
music awards like 金曲奖 are all based in Taiwan, but the ballgame is very
different in Taiwan as compared to China, and I had more confidence in China
because of my previous experiences and personal network there.
My
experience in doing business in China is more robust than my experiences
dealing with the Taiwanese. The Taiwanese and the Mainland Chinese are quite
different when it comes to business negotiations. The way they communicate is
different. When I communicate with Mainland Chinese, the experience is a lot
richer. When they speak, I am aware of their
communication nuances. But I don’t understand the Taiwanese. They are faster,
smarter and quicker than Singaporeans. Both countries are. But if I cannot
guess what they are trying to say, I’m definitely on the losing end. On the other hand, the Mainland Chinese have a lot of respect for Singaporeans, and they
love working with us because we are a man of our words. Their perception is that
Singaporeans are very organized and systematic, we mean what we say, and we are very honest folks. So when they are talking to us, they
try to do that as well. Personally, I am more at ease dealing with the Mainland Chinese
than the Taiwanese. Hence, I feel that I would have a better chance in dealing
with the Mainland market.
Of course,
it’s also because the Taiwan market is very saturated. Its population and media
would be limited, as compared to China, which is so huge that there are no
rules to it. No rules seem to be a bad thing to many Singaporeans, but it’s a
very good thing for business, because you can create your own rules. There will
be gaps and loopholes which are opportunities that you can use to penetrate the
market. Even if you cannot make it to the top 3 stations, you can always make
it to the fourth, fifth and sixth station because there are over a thousand
radio stations there! There are so many ways that you can plan to succeed in China,
whereas in the limitations of an island-city, there will always be
monopolization.
As an artiste manager, how did
you bring out the best in her? What was your value add?
The success
of artiste depends on how the manager can make things happen, so you would feel
guilty if you are not working hard enough. We analyzed the gaps based on whatever was
established earlier, and we recognized a few flaws that needed to be filled,
including the need for people to recognize her face. Her songs are popular in
China, people recognize her voice but we found that there was a lack of
recognition of her face, and it’s a very big problem for artistes. Her previous
songs have been used in many dramas, even in Taiwan and China, so we did not
have to re-introduce her songs, and we could use the songs as a penetration
point, but people don’t know much about her: what she does, what’s her
background and her personality.
Hence, we tried to
arrange for promotions or work that she had the opportunity to talk about
herself, and not about her voice or the songs. We also structured our press kit
in such a way that it focused all towards her perspectives of life. Most of the
interviews that we did were focused on her personality. We capitalized stronger
exposure on magazines for visibility. We had some magazine coverage such as
Cosmopolitan and covers on a few other local publications. However, we did not have time for TV because TV promotions were
blocked off in slots. TV recordings are usually done back to back in three
days, and they would do record all the episodes for the month in one shot. But
our previous promo schedule did not allow us to make it for TV, so it is
something that we are hoping to do in the months to come, together with events.
Our partners
in China are very well connected to the media, but no company should be
totally dependent on their partners. I created an entire list of DJs and I talk
to them every night on Weibo during that period to ask them if everything was
ok, and whether they have received the songs, and asked if there was any help
that they needed, and they came back saying, “You know what, no other managers
have done this.” It is the type of connection that you create: through the
familiarity of the connections from our china partners, coupled with the level
of personalization through the effort you put in, then they are more willing to
push your songs, and when they play your songs, they would say a little more
about you. When they need a favor like recording a radio ID, they would just
come straight to me, and I would get it done for them. These are very small
favors, but it’s very important to show sincerity, especially when you are not
a diva, people don’t come begging at your knees, but at the same time, you are
not a new comer, so we are somewhere in between. The DJs know her, but we just
wanted to humanize her a little.
How do you arrange her promotional
work?
When we
travel, it’s always starting with Beijing first, because that’s where all the
major media companies are. Shanghai houses the major fashion brands, so you
need to know what you are up for, then you would plan your route that way. When
we plan our route, other than Beijing, we would also plan some work in other
cities, and the other promotions that are alongside those work. There are
hundreds of media platforms in Beijing alone, and two weeks are not even enough
to cover Beijing alone.
We try to
promote her material with movie companies, but a lot of them have exclusive
relationships with labels, so it’s a little tougher, unless the director happen
to like her song so much. This is a totally different track to take, and it
also depends on how much time I have!
Any advice for someone who’s
interested in becoming an artiste manager?
A manager’s
job is actually full-time, yet I do not invest 100% of my time to her career,
just as she doesn’t either. I have my own company to handle as well, partially
because of bread and butter, and partially because of my passion (as a social
media consultant). But if you wanted to be a manager, you would really have to
be whole-heartedly devoting 110% of your time in this, because there is so much
networking and conceptualizing to do. I spend a lot of time thinking,
strategizing, and talking to people. You have to buy the air ticket, fly over,
and just spend the time renewing yourself with the market and your networks.
For anyone
who wants to embark on a career managing artistes, there is a lot of thinking
involved behind. Artistes are usually more passive, you cannot expect them to
go out and meet these people, so that’s why she hires a manager for all this. I
need to make those visions come true. Whether an artiste performs well
depends a lot on her team. An artiste’s report card comes when he/ she performs
on stage, but that passageway to the stage is a long route that depends on the
efforts of the entire team.
Building
relationships need time. It’s the same for all businesses. You don’t create
your networks when you need them. Create your networks before you need them.
You can’t have an agenda then go meet people. They would be more willing to see
you. When I went to visit the social media companies in China (Youku, Sina,
NetEast, Baidu), I simply brought my bakwa (roasted pork) and pandan cake to
them just to say hi and simply just understand who I’m talking to and how we
can help each other. You need to add value to people, and even if you don’t get
to work with each other, never mind, in the end you get to know a friend. And
if you ever get to work together in the future, you wouldn’t be strangers by
then. Today, many of the business contacts that I have are people whom I got to
know from ten years ago. Trust is also built with time, and hence networks need
to be built ahead of time, and not when you need it.
In
Singapore, people are generally brought up in a system to follow, and not to
lead or initiate. Yet in the entertainment industry, there is no system, and
you have to create it. So you will need to be flexible and versatile. There are
many musicians with ideals and dreams, but are not willing to work hard enough
to fulfill them. If you’d to compare ourselves to those in China, you would
feel so guilty and absolutely embarrassed. If anyone were to step up to say
they are willing to learn this, I would be happy to teach, but I can tell you
it’s not easy at all. You carry bags, clear the shit, do the things that the
prince and princesses in Singapore are not used to doing.
Locally,
there are simply not enough talents to support these musicians so that they
could concentrate on honing their craft. I feel that musicians should be left
to do what they do best. They should not deal with things like accounting, book
keeping, or drafting of contracts. They should share their ideas, then let
other people do it for them.
What is your vision for Joi as an
artiste?
Joi’s
vision is very simple. She just wants to continue singing to a lot of people
and she wants to spread her positive messages to them. I have larger visions
for her.
My vision
is to put her in front of an audience of 10,000 people. It’s not hard, but for
her, she is not ready yet. We want
people to come because they want to listen, not because of a marketing stunt
typical of that from a big label where concert tickets are given out to
sponsors. I want her to be a household name not only in Singapore, but also in
China and Taiwan. I’m not saying that I can make it come true, because for
every singer, at some point in time, they may need someone else to bring them
higher. I’m not saying that she needs to stick by me. Funding may be a
challenge, but It’s not impossible. I can’t tell you the odds yet, until I
spend time working on that part. I’m more of an idealist though, and as long as
I see there’s a potential, even if the chances are slim, I would still do it.
Opportunities are there for people who are prepared. Even if it doesn’t happen,
so what? At least you don’t ponder in your life, what if?
What do you think of the future
of the music industry in Asia? What are the top three trends that you’d
predict?
I may not have enough experience to make a very impactful statement
on this, but my take on the top three trends is:
1. Digital
- the popularity of buying digital
music will increase with the maturity of the market. I feel that those who
don’t buy digital music yet is not because of its cost but because of the
maturity of the market, and that will improve.
2. We
will all go back to the basics of A&R and conceptualization. People will
start to realize that it’s pointless making seven filler tracks and three good
tracks, and you’d rather spend more time on that three tracks, and that’s why
in Japan and Korea, EPs and mini albums are more popular, rather than full albums.
You can see that trend happening in Taiwan and China now.
3. There
will be more popularity on live performances. So people who can’t sing are
gone. People who don’t improve themselves will be taken over by the market.
There won’t be any more of the 偶像派 Idol types. If you want to be in
idol type, you would need to be an 偶像实力 artiste with real talent, so
there is a lot of stress on musicians trying to better themselves, and only the
strongest can survive. The market will become like what it used to be, it’s
going to narrow down, rather than expand. The expansion will come from your
Youtube stars and other options of entertainment, but if you are talking about
the music industry as a career, there would be a cleaning up of trash in the
market.
